Primarily - motivation and discipline. Obviously motivation is what gets people to start something new. However, once people have made that first step, they'll realize that learning is not instantaneous and requires effort. This is where individuals need the discipline to continue learning. Personally, I think this is one of the reasons why we have such great success learning as children - we're forced to. Not necessarily personal discipline, but anyone would have an easier time learning if they were forced into 5-8 hours a day classes.

Discipline and lack of penalty is also why I think free learning materials suffer their high drop-off rates. The low barrier of entrance means anyone can join and the lack of penalizing you for not practicing means you can just stop.

Secondary - western education argues against memorization for "higher level" learning. Knowing all the syntax structures of a programming language doesn't mean you know how to code, so there is a de-emphasis on learning them. However, I agree that you do need some degree of memorization to serve as your foundation for higher level knowledge. As someone else said, imagine trying to write an essay without knowing any words. My PhD research is actually focusing on this to identify students that need that foundational knowledge.

Finally - our "fear of incompetence". I believe we don't want to be viewed as unable to do something and if we are presented with something that challenges our competence, we avoid it in lieu for things we do excel in. Children are given a sort of "free pass" because we know they don't know things.

You can get started in 1 minute, when you spot a paragraph that you like on the web:

1. create an account on https://booxia.wensia.com/

2. install the browser extension

3. highlight the paragraph and choose Save to Booxia.

You'll start getting spaced repetition emails with that.

Disclosure: I built the service.

Sorry, I meant for my post to be an explanation of why people don't use spaced repetition. It is not that they don't believe it works, its a combination of the prescribed issues.

Also, as I noted, spaced repetition emails will only do so much. You may see decent metrics, but that may not translate to actual learning.

Hey this is really cool. Thanks for sharing.

Appreciate your comment :) I don't know how to market this, besides posting on HN.

I'll tell all my friends at school about it. I'm taking CCNP courses, and our textbook is online... you thinking what I'm thinking? Love the extension, bro.

Hah :) Thank you!

A lot of what you're talking about is discussed in the following link, so I figured I'd mention it:

https://teachtogether.tech/ / Greg Wilson

I'm also very interested in tech education and edtech.

Yup! I'd highly recommend reading through this link as it is a great literature review of education theory and how it relates to CS Education.

Honestly, I haven't found a need for it yet.

I am a student studying CS, and none of my coursework really requires heavy memorization for exams or assignments. For the most part, even if I need to remember some algorithm, it is simple enough that it can be derived or remembered for lecture.

However, my SO is pre-med, and consistently uses Anki to great success. Her exams are very centered on information which needs to be memorized, including standardized exams like the MCAT. I think this is where spaced repetition programs shine.

Generally, people don't need to memorize large amounts of information, they need a few facts and relations to each other. This can easily be achieved with hand-written or typed notes which an individual can review when needed.

I used (many years ago, with Mnemosyne) spaces repetition on CS and AI history. It is really useful to have this extra context available during my normal activities. It allows me to see modern development in a historic context.

This is probably why the preeminent use of Spaced Repetition is language learning. You can learn all the grammar you want, but without the raw vocabulary memorization, that's not going to do you any good.

I've been using spaced repeition to review highlights from books. I do it with Readwise (not affiliated, just a very happy customer). A large part of the reason I never stuck to Anki was the friction of creating, syncing, formatting the cards. This tool plugs into your services automatically so takes care of that.

https://readwise.io/

Related:

Quantumn Country: A free introduction to quantum computing and quantum mechanics. Uses spaced repetition baked in directly into the article to aid comprehension and retention.

https://quantum.country/

Readwise looks great, but their pricing is pretty buried...

They have two tiers IIRC, $4 and $9/mo.

I use it (Anki), but this is the 3rd time I got started using it (I dropped off twice).

For me, personally, these are the reasons:

- It was kind of annoying to do Anki every day at first. Cards always seemed either blindingly obvious (and seemingly a waste of time), or I just didn't know the content (in which case, it was frustrating knowing I'd have to memorize it right there since I knew it'd pop up again in a few cards). Not knowing the content tended to be caused by having too much info on the Anki card.

- I didn't see the benefit clearly until after a few weeks of doing it, when stuff EVENTUALLY sunk in.

- About 70% of the time, I discovered that the card I created was inadequate in some way.

    * Some I just deleted because they were discovered to be redundant (i.e. covered by another card)

    * Some I discovered to have to much info (so I had to break it into more cards)

    * Some were just awkwardly phrased

    * Some were good cards but displayed weirdly in the Anki mobile app.

I'd say the #1 thing that kept me from fully adopting it:

Not making cards as atomized as possible made things a pain.

I was lazy and made cards contain more info with the justification that I needed to see everything at once in context. This resulted in bloated cards and frustration.

Trust me: Every card should contain one idea. It will result in you making tons of cards, but it will make your daily Anki a lot less frustrating (and you'll be more likely to do it).

I'm using it for language learning where Anki is commonly mentioned. I didn't see the value in Anki until I started adding a couple hundred of my own cards. There's this annoying grind at the beginning but then it gets much better. I don't know a single product that is just so essential for an activity other than Anki.

I'm the author of Polar:

https://getpolarized.io/

Spaced repetition is a game-changer but right now it's not really adopted outside of say Duolingo and Quizlet.

I think the reason why is that integrating spaced-repetition into your workflow is painful.

If you use Evernote or Onenote and Kindle or maybe something like Anki then you're constantly switching back and forth.

Polar changes this by making a fully integrated reading, annotation, note and spaced repetition platform.

You can read a PDF, highlight an important piece of text, convert it to a flashcard, then sync it to Anki directly - all without ever leaving Polar.

Further, we also have our own spaced repetition algorithm if you just want to use Polar directly. If you're not an Anki user this might be easier since Anki can be difficult for some people to configure.

We're REALLY close to 2.0 and have some important features including EPUB, annotations for tags and a web-based annotation system so that you can highlight and create flashcards directly in the browser.

We also support a really cool feature called incremental reading which allows you to easily suspend/resume your reading to resume where you left off. All your highlights can also be reviewed by spaced repetition algorithms so you can re-read core parts of your document repository.

I'm on Discord if you guys have any questions:

https://discordapp.com/invite/GT8MhA6

I created https://idorecall.com/ and it is different than apps like Anki. You upload your learning materials into iDoRecall. File types such as .docx, .pptx, .pdf, images files or add media share links from YouTube, Vimeo, Soundcloud, etc. You consume your content in iDR. When you come across a concept or fact that you want to remember, create a linked spaced-repetition flashcard. When you practice your flashcards, if you struggle with an answer, click a link to open up the source file or video at the exact location where you created the card. Refresh your memory and then get back to your practice session. Also, you can create study groups with classmates and collaborate, sharing files and flashcards. I have written about my background and story https://bit.ly/2Tp3vTr

Michael Nielsen's essay, Augmenting Long-term Memory, points to an article from the late 80s which goes through a list of reasons why "Spacing Effect" hasn't implemented been implemented in US's teaching system.

http://augmentingcognition.com/assets/Dempster1988.pdf

I do not need to memorize large amounts of factual information; computers are much better at it than I will ever be.

I am - or at least plan to. I am writing a knowledge base, focused around a sort of mind-map of information and sources - and for each node I am adding a series of Q&As that can be used for spaced rep.

My goal is a few fold:

1. I research plenty of things in life and I need to document my findings. Not some grand importance to my "findings", merely that I've found I tend to summarize to such an extreme degree that I lose how I came to that summarization.

2. I want to remember my summarizations mentioned above.

3. I want to run a self-experiment on my .. I guess, random access memory. I tend to have terrible memory for the little random details of live these days. What was that movie name? What was that actors name? What street does X person live on? What is my wife's phone number? etc.

I never seem to run into this problem in things I "care" about, namely tech, programming and etc. But still, it bothers me how frequently I draw a blank from my memory. While I don't often see many repeats in this "random access memory" problem (aka movie names/etc), I am curious if I can improve this memory pattern by memorizing the things I so easily forget. I have no data backing it up, I'm just curious.

Why am I writing my own tool instead of Anki/etc? There's a few side features that I want to design a UX around, and see how it goes. It's all an experiment in the UX of information storage, retrieval and memorization/retention.

You might benefit from a tool called Roam Research:

https://www.nateliason.com/blog/roam

+1 this tool is slowly changing the way I think about digital information. Early stage but they're on a great course!

Because to me holding references to things is more valuable than holding knowledge in. I don't need to memorize anything, just need to have awareness of different approaches and things to solve problems. Which comes with time by using anything.

There is no "instead". Cognitive science shows you need memorization for creativity & critical thinking. (Imagine writing an essay if you know no words!) https://ncase.me/remember/

Did you learn words in your native language by deliberately memorizing them?

Yes, in middle school we had weekly tests where we got graded on our recollection of that week's vocabulary.

Wow, that sounds excruciating.

This is quite frequent in countries of the ex-soviet block. Most of the language classes we had were about rote memorization and recall of words without context.

It's a common thing in the United States too.

Right, I went to middle school in Maine (which is in the United States for those that are not that acquainted with it.) in an Urban region.

Sure. I remember adding words to my kids' vocabulary by repeating them and using them in context.

I didn't have to repeat any words for my kids - they'd figure out words like Gaurus and spoiler, sometimes even faster than their parents.

Kids pick up language differently though. Look at feral kids - the ones who have never picked up a language as a child often don't pick any languages up even later in life.

While my niece uses flash cards with her daughter as a game. She's not yet 2 and has 100 words already.

You can leave it all to chance, do it the same way the good ol parents did, it was good enough for me! Or you can plan how you raise your child.

Not a helicopter parent. Young Becky is as independent and happy as any other toddler.

I looked hard for an app that would help me record a piece of information that I want to revisit again and again with decreasing frequency until I've internalised it.

I tried Anki, but it was too cumbersome.

The way I do it at present is to write a note/attach a screenshot to a reminder on Google Keep which repeats daily, or maybe every 2 or 3 days.

I usually keep something on for 4-8 weeks until the thought or idea has been completely internalised.

Have you tried Polar? https://getpolarized.io

What do you think about https://booxia.wensia.com ?

Because last time I used it (Anki), the app didn't allow you to "pause" your learning. It happened to me a couple times that I missed a week for some reason (usually a deadline), and when I came back to my deck I had hundreds of well-known cards to catch up to.

This created a vicious cycle: my commute was no longer enough to review so many card, I kept falling behind, and the pile just kept getting bigger. I started dreading opening the app more and more, until I officially gave up and deleted everything.

"Cards to catch up to" is just "cards Anki predicts you're in danger of forgetting". As long as you can recall a reasonable % of the cards you're reviewing, you aren't "falling behind" at all! Indeed, Anki will give you "extra credit" for recalling a card that you didn't review on schedule, so the "catch up" process is a lot more effective than it appears st first glance.

It's nice, but facts are not the bottleneck to my development

What is the bottleneck your you?

honestly i get the theory behind spaced repetition, but the format of Anki cards doesnt work for me. it is just hard to get onboard with making Anki cards for myself. it feels like too atomic of a piece of knowledge and in making the card i've already internalized it or likely know all I need to know to look it up in future. I know this isn't 100% true, but thats the mental hurdle I have when thinking about why I dont make Anki cards.

> it is just hard to get onboard with making Anki cards for myself

I just scraped some info from various sources, and used a bit of text processing to clean it up and get it into the semicolon-separated format for import into Anki.

No brainer.

You don't want to be making large numbers of Anki cards using its unwieldy UI.

> in making the card i've already internalized it

When you're making a new card, it may feel like you have it internalized, but that's only for a half hour or so. It's just short-term memory.

I understand your feeling, that's my biggest gripe too. Making cards is chore, with lots of copy-pasting and editing, sometimes even image editing. As time goes it also gets more and more disconnected from the context; I sometimes as myself, why did I even want to learn this?

Have you tried premade decks? What was your experience with those?

I find the act of creating the card is part of the process of memorizing and internalizing the fact. I agree with others here that using Anki can be a real chore sometimes; one has to devote a chunk of time just learning how to use Anki.

With more and more use, using Anki becomes second nature like with any application.

I got the most out of Anki after watching videos; this one in particular opened doors for me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bwcr25334J8&t=99s

It doesn't work in practice. It might work if you were trying to memorize the capital city of something, but it forces you to really narrow down the scope. That's why Duolingo does so poorly compared to just going into a different language forum and immersing yourself.

Also a big part of memory is building multiple connections. Spaced repetition tends to be in an island. It could be less effective than other techniques, like encoding.

The cards used in spaced repetition can contain connections. I put related words and other connecting information on many of my cards. That information isn't part of what must be recalled for a "good", but I review it when the card comes up.

I self-learned 5 languages to fluency. Getting the vocab right is absolutely necessary. They are the tools you need to get work done.

But yeah, you have to use the tools as well.

Self-learned using spaced repetition/Duolingo or another technique?

https://www.executeprogram.com uses it and it’s really great. Eventually it’s 19 bucks a month but probably worth it if it helps get you past those annoying coder pad screens everyone seems to love these days.

This looks amazing, thank you for mentioning it. Do you have experience with it? Are there more advanced topics, or is it only aimed at beginners?

Yeah, I did the “JavaScript arrays” one. Don’t let the topic name fool you... They don’t show you everything up front. All those topics get pretty advanced.

I don't need to memorize anything. Information I use on a daily basis is easily recalled. Information I use infrequently can be looked up on my phone.

Spaced repetition might help if I was studying for a test or preparing for a game show.

I am, I intentionally repeat things I learned on the day itself before bed and at the end of the week. You just have to think about something for it to be a recollection.

This is a technique called "active recall" and is a good practice!

Memorizing large amounts of factual information just isn't something I have much use for.

I haven't found memorizing to be very useful as a skill.

I find it so much more useful to build internal graph representations for concepts and tying memories to context instead.

Memory in isolation is like having a bunch of nodes without an edge list.

Using it with Anki and Notion for refining new concepts before they go in Anki

I had pretty much the same workflow. Then I made Mochi[0] so that I could keep my notes and cards in the same app, and link them together mind-map-style.

[0] https://mochi.cards/

How does your process look like? You take your notes in notion, and move (some parts of?) them to Anki?

I take a lot of notes in notion. After some time i refine the notes and extract question-style concepts that i can add in Anki.

How does that look like to you?

It's near mandatory for self-teaching yourself a new language.

I don't have enough need to memorize anything.