Hacker Newsnew | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submitlogin

Saying "we apologize" multiple times is the same as "we're sorry".

The difference is that the first indicates that "we" want you to feel better, while the second indicates empathy. When I'm on the receiving end, my gut reaction is almost exactly opposite.

Second, their claim is that this is a miscommunication appears to be a CYA lie. The recipient has shared sufficient details of what actually happened that either he is lying, or they are. An apology that asks the recipient to swallow a lie is not much of an apology.

You think that this is a good apology. I think that it is a terrible one. Here is what an apology that I call good would look like:

We, the NumFOCUS Code of Conduct Enforcement Committee, issue a public apology to Jeremy Howard for our handling of the JupyterCon 2020 reports. We did poorly on multiple levels. Therefore we have requested our board of directors to take over the investigation of those reports, and to separately investigate our mishandling of the situation.

We deeply regret the pain and anguish that we caused, and we are sorry for it.

Incidentally doing this would have been free to them. Everyone knows that they screwed up. At this point the board would be remiss to NOT investigate, so asking the board to do what it has to do anyways costs them nothing. And they wouldn't have said something that sounds like a lie.



I maintain that "we apologize" and "we are sorry" are identical in meaning, except to those straining to be ungenerous, always demanding "just a bit more" prostration than was offered.

Your compact "good apology" wording is fine, too!

But if they'd used that, exactly, plenty of people would still be hair-splitting & demanding more – maybe even you, since even your wording doesn't do most of the things your first post above wanted!

It also fails to 'acknowledge' the specific "list of things" you wanted to see. It also offers nothing more "in amends" than they already offered. It also suggests no "consequences" for those who erred. Your added cheap-but-emotionally-performative intensifier words – "we deeply regret the pain and anguish" – are also viewed as "meaningless hollow BS" by many.

See how easy it is to nitpick tone?

The social function of apologies also requires gracious acceptance of actual admissions of error.


But if they'd used that, exactly, plenty of people would still be hair-splitting & demanding more – maybe even you, since even your wording doesn't do most of the things your first post above wanted!

The problem is that when you list your acknowledgements and chosen actions, you're implicitly refusing to acknowledge anything else and are indicating that no further actions will be taken.

When the apology is open-ended, and includes further specific actions such as an independent investigation, then you've done none of that.

The social function of apologies also requires gracious acceptance of actual admissions of error.

When the apology performs the social functions of apologies, it only works when the recipient graciously accepts.

But when the apology fails to perform the social functions of an apology, there is no obligation on the recipient to pretend acceptance.




Guidelines | FAQ | Lists | API | Security | Legal | Apply to YC | Contact

Search: