So what?
In that case they created a great value for someone (users).
No imagine if the code was released under more restrictive license. They don't use, they create nothing greater, and users don't get better product. Whose win is this exactly?
Because that's a false dichotomy. Corporations will always prefer BSD code to GPL code. But there are many examples of corporations contributing GPL code to GPL projects. If the same projects were BSD licensed, then the corporation might have just forked them and their improvements would then not have been made widely available.
You just gave another false dichotomy. Just because a corporation looks to use BSD licensing doesn't mean it won't contribute back. You're attempting to derive intent from a license choice. It's not that simple.
No, I didn't. Notice how I used words like "might", implying that the scenario I described is but one of many plausible scenarios.
Certainly corporations contribute code to BSD-licensed projects. But equally certain is the fact that some corporations contribute code to GPL-licensed projects when they otherwise would have kept their code to themselves if they weren't legally compelled to open it.
It's a philosophical issue. The original developer who uses GPL often thinks of what they are doing as gifting their work to the world. Having it sequestered into a money making project is rather like seeing the birthday present you bought for a friend sold on Ebay.
They didn't lose anything, but they didn't gain anything either. If they had GPL'd their project, they would have gained improvements. So by choosing the BSD license they've lost potential gains. So it is seen by many as a loss.
The company in scenario A isn't the same one in scenario B. If a company isn't going to contribute their improvements to a BSD project, what makes you think they're going to open-source their entire code base just to "grudgingly" use a GPL project?
How do you know they aren't the same company? Who said anything about "their entire code base"? As this article says, Apple distributes plenty of GPL software. Did they release their entire code base?
Let me contrive a hypothetical, if it's still not clear to you...
Imagine you're a ruthless corporation and you don't care at all about the open source community. There is an open source software package that solves 95% of a problem for you.
If it's BSD, you will probably take it, write that 5%, use it, and not contribute anything back.
If it's GPL, you will probably take it, write that 5%, use it, and then grudgingly release that 5% back to the community so you don't get sued.
Note that I'm not saying GPL is always the best option and BSD is always worse. I'm just pointing out that, in your previous post, you miss out on one of the advantages of the GPL: it can encourage the release of open source code that otherwise would not have happened.
Or, if it's GPL, you won't take it, and you will write your own in-house version which you'll never release. That is the more likely scenario.
You're presenting a bit of a false dichotomy. If a company that's adamant against open-sourcing their work can't use a GPL solution, they're not going to shrug their shoulders, use it anyway, and then release their changes. They're going to spend more money on an in-house solution because they have complete control over it and know it won't bite them in the ass in the future.
> Or, if it's GPL, you won't take it, and you will write your own in-house version which you'll never release.
Yes, that's why I said "probably", not "definitely". It's misleading to ignore both possibilities and pretend that only one will ever happen. That's why I made my original post.
> You're presenting a bit of a false dichotomy.
Only if you misread my post.
> If a company that's adamant against open-sourcing their work can't use a GPL solution, they're not going to shrug their shoulders, use it anyway, and then release their changes.
If they're "adamant against open-sourcing their work", then by definition they will never open source anything. So? That's not the type of corporation I was talking about in my post.
I didn't. I was contriving a hypothetical to illustrate how the GPL can produce a positive result in some cases that BSD-like licenses cannot. That's why I started my post with "Let me contrive a hypothetical".
I even explicitly pointed this out at the end of my post by saying, "Note that I'm not saying GPL is always the best option and BSD is always worse. I'm just pointing out that, in your previous post, you miss out on one of the advantages of the GPL: it can encourage the release of open source code that otherwise would not have happened."
I did this because I knew that otherwise someone would misinterpret my post as saying the GPL is universally perfect in all situations, or that the situation I described in my contrived hypothetical was the only possible situation that could ever occur. I'm not sure how I could have made that more clear.
> > That's not the type of corporation I was talking about in my post.
> Then what did you mean by:
> > Imagine you're a ruthless corporation and you don't care at all about the open source community.
A ruthless corporation that doesn't care about the open source community (which I think describes most corporations, FWIW) is very different than "a company that's adamant against open-sourcing". The former will contribute open source code when it is in their economic best interest, but they won't go out of their way to play nice with the open source folks. The latter will sacrifice their economic interests just to stick to their ideology.
> A ruthless corporation that doesn't care about the open source community (which I think describes most corporations, FWIW) is very different than "a company that's adamant against open-sourcing". The former will contribute open source code when it is in their economic best interest, but they won't go out of their way to play nice with the open source folks. The latter will sacrifice their economic interests just to stick to their ideology.
If they don't want to contribute any coding work back to the community at large, then let them start from scratch and build something they have full control over. I don't see why the open-source community should have to accommodate them if they're not going to contribute back to that community.
I've seen that happen. I've got no problem with it. In fact I think allowing it to happen is much more Free than the approach favored by the FSF.
The code that I release to the world is my own work product, and it is my choice to make it available to others. If someone else improves on it, that's great. Period. I feel no need to try to dictate to them what they can do with it. That's their work product, and their choice if they want to make it available to others.
