Hey hey, its your posts which started with talking about how life was tough to get a bank account for example.
> " to be able to open a bank account/do other administrative shit with just one ID card."
Where did getting public healthcare, education or crossing borders come up? For those I would point out other known failings. Come now, that's nearly a bait and switch.
In your second response you say:
" Maybe your perspective is one of having a fixed residence for all of your life. Unfortunately, my life didn't progress that way and every time I move to a new place I have to go through the same rigmarole all over again."
So perhaps if you aren't referring to bank accounts you may mean education which you refer to. Thats possible with a transfer certificate and transcripts, and at most, a birth certificate. Having personally navigated one of the worst possible categories of transfers into the Indian education system, I can say that Identity, was never an issue. Sloth, confounding rules, paperwork were greater transgressors.
Now regards your other points. Having several family members in defense, and the government ID is not an issue for them. As far as I know the Def. forces have their own ways of ensuring proof of residence. I can try and check up to confirm if need be.
Regarding the list of ID systems you provided.
PAN: Non tax payers dont have them. But Tax payers do. And given the recent conversions in Tax policy, thats a larger portion of the population. But that still ignroes -
Ration Card: This is extremely common. From discussions with hired help on their situation, they are nearly religious in the way they value the card and make sure they have one. And for a more universal measure of its prevalence, do note that its one of the first and most common things given to people to regularize slums and shanties. So for the worse off sections of society its extremely prevalent.
And if THAT doesn't work: There are Voter ID cards which fill the void for people who don't travel.
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These are issues which are not tech issues, but in reality are people problems. We can never remove the need for discipline, civic sense, and standards in service delivery.
Other countries have managed without retina scanners, or finger print IDs of all their citizens. Saying that we are a special case where we need tech to solve our problems is a red herring. Its also a rejection of responsibility and the burden we must carry. There is no quick fix for this.
There is also a major reason why all those countries which did conceive of using a UID system like ours, balked and fled.
If having the finger prints of every citizen doesn't bother you, then we really can't see eye to eye.
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It seems you are mostly troubled by the paper work, in particular, for proof of residence.
That's not something the UID system will ever solve. The Govt has no intention of ever rolling back those clauses. The political calculus and players are harshly inimical at worst to the idea, and couldn't care less if they tried, at best.
UID or not, you will always need to provide proof that you live there.
The only thing the UID will do is become an umbrella number which will help track where you stay, which Cafe's you use and when, what your taxes are and more. All in the name of helping people suffering from middle men and not being able to get their ration.
There is already constant feature creep - the ideal behind this was a way to help the poorer of us get access to resources and help, without the middle man. It is written in its founding document that no services will be denied due to lack of a UID.
Recently the MP govt. stated that a UID card is compulsory to avail of piped gas. You have good reason to trust your govt. I assume.
Well my response wasn't really a blog post about why I want the UID system. It was simply an example of where it might be useful. I don't see how that's a bait and switch, it seems like you're more concerned about what I didn't say than what I did say in my post.
I come from a defense background, so lets just put that issue to rest right there. Are you bothered that I didn't say that in my first/second/third post either ?
It looks like you are plainly against the UID system, maybe that's coming out of your frustration of needing one for a gas pipeline, or maybe it's borne out of something else.
I acknowledge all your points about how the UID won't help in many situations. But the one thing it surely will enable is simplicity of documentation, and like I said before, I certainly welcome that.
There is a definite problem in India with 'proving who you say you are' - I hope the UID system will solve that to a certain extent.
What countries are you talking about ? Brazil, Chile, UAE, countries in the European Union, Mexico, Peru, Ecuador, etc. all have UID systems in place. These tie in their ID, tax info, etc. into a single card. I've seen first hand how their IDs help them go through life and get out of the documentation hell that we suffer from in India.
In every response you are suggesting alternatives (hey, I could give my driving license for that, or there I could give my ration card, or wait in that other place they might accept my voter ID) to a UID system. The idea of documentation simplification is that you need just one ID for all of those things. (education, health, banks, etc.) Not only is it easier for the person presenting the ID, but it reduces the back end processing required for the service provider. When we talk of numbers as large as 1 billion, those inefficiencies stack up pretty quick.
You can go on talking about the failings of each scenario but the fact is that many Indians have no IDs (my grandfather didn't have any legit ID until he was 92, when we applied for a passport for him to go to Egypt). Maybe your domestic help have ration cards but please don't project your limited experience onto everyone else, that hardly makes for a valid argument.
Not to mention the authenticity of people's ration cards, voter's IDs, driving licenses, birth certificates, transcripts, transfer certificates, etc. That's a whole can of worms in itself.
It appears that you're afraid that our government will bungle up the whole initiative. Well, that of course is common in India and a risk with almost any initiative. Still, that's not a reason to not take initiatives in the first place.
> " to be able to open a bank account/do other administrative shit with just one ID card."
Where did getting public healthcare, education or crossing borders come up? For those I would point out other known failings. Come now, that's nearly a bait and switch.
In your second response you say:
" Maybe your perspective is one of having a fixed residence for all of your life. Unfortunately, my life didn't progress that way and every time I move to a new place I have to go through the same rigmarole all over again."
So perhaps if you aren't referring to bank accounts you may mean education which you refer to. Thats possible with a transfer certificate and transcripts, and at most, a birth certificate. Having personally navigated one of the worst possible categories of transfers into the Indian education system, I can say that Identity, was never an issue. Sloth, confounding rules, paperwork were greater transgressors.
Now regards your other points. Having several family members in defense, and the government ID is not an issue for them. As far as I know the Def. forces have their own ways of ensuring proof of residence. I can try and check up to confirm if need be.
Regarding the list of ID systems you provided.
PAN: Non tax payers dont have them. But Tax payers do. And given the recent conversions in Tax policy, thats a larger portion of the population. But that still ignroes -
Ration Card: This is extremely common. From discussions with hired help on their situation, they are nearly religious in the way they value the card and make sure they have one. And for a more universal measure of its prevalence, do note that its one of the first and most common things given to people to regularize slums and shanties. So for the worse off sections of society its extremely prevalent.
And if THAT doesn't work: There are Voter ID cards which fill the void for people who don't travel.
-----------------------
These are issues which are not tech issues, but in reality are people problems. We can never remove the need for discipline, civic sense, and standards in service delivery.
Other countries have managed without retina scanners, or finger print IDs of all their citizens. Saying that we are a special case where we need tech to solve our problems is a red herring. Its also a rejection of responsibility and the burden we must carry. There is no quick fix for this.
There is also a major reason why all those countries which did conceive of using a UID system like ours, balked and fled.
If having the finger prints of every citizen doesn't bother you, then we really can't see eye to eye.
-----------------------
It seems you are mostly troubled by the paper work, in particular, for proof of residence.
That's not something the UID system will ever solve. The Govt has no intention of ever rolling back those clauses. The political calculus and players are harshly inimical at worst to the idea, and couldn't care less if they tried, at best.
UID or not, you will always need to provide proof that you live there.
The only thing the UID will do is become an umbrella number which will help track where you stay, which Cafe's you use and when, what your taxes are and more. All in the name of helping people suffering from middle men and not being able to get their ration.
There is already constant feature creep - the ideal behind this was a way to help the poorer of us get access to resources and help, without the middle man. It is written in its founding document that no services will be denied due to lack of a UID.
Recently the MP govt. stated that a UID card is compulsory to avail of piped gas. You have good reason to trust your govt. I assume.
The convenience perhaps.